Christ Had Room for Quantum Physics
I found the following from moby via doug pagitt. While I don’t always find dichotomizing Christ from Christianity helpful, I did find this insightful:
so, do you think that it’s time to invent a new religion?
i mean, i know that sounds absurd and absurdly presumptuous.
but what do we know now that is different from what we
knew ages ago?
that the universe is gigantic?
that the universe is old?
that we are made up of matter that used to be other things?
that our actions are seemingly insignificant from a universal perspective?
that matter, at it’s most basic level, doesn’t do what
we think it would/should do?
i sound flippant.
but really, given what we know about the universe and about ourselves, isn’t it absurd to hold on to conventional ideas about our significance and identity and relevance and so on?
again, i sound flippant.
i don’t mean to.
but it’s hard to describe this in a journal(not blog)entry.
i actually think that the teachings of christ accomodate most of the new ways in which we perceive ourselves and our world.
the problem is that although the teachings of christ accomodate this, contemporary christianity does not.
here’s more seriousness dressed up as flippancy:
christ: acknowledging quantum realities.
christiantiy: depressingly newtonian.
does that make any sense?
well, to me it does.
and to some of you it might make sense, also.
i’m sorry that i’m being light and flippant.
i should just be straightforward.
we know things about our universe and about our world and about ourselves that make our previously held ideas about human significance utterly absurd. in order to move forward we need to accept that how we understand ourselves in the future has to be informed by what we know about ourselves from a quantum perspective.
and luckily, there’s not a christian(or new testament)perspective that compels us to hold on to much of tradition.
many christians might disagree, but i would ask them to cite scripture to support their dissent.
i know, ‘quantum perspective’ sounds nonsensical and nerdy.
but we need to move on(no political pun intended).
we all know better.
we’re all holding on to past conceptions of human endeavours and human significance, and they’re outdated and erroneous and anachronistic.
our human significance is both far greater and far smaller than anything than we’ve hitherto recognized.
that is the truth.
we are paradoxical little creatures.
we need a new way in which to look at ourselves and in which to understand our lives and our significance.
there, that’s all i have to say for now.
thanks for listening.
i guess i’ll write more later if anyone’s interested.
if not: uh, go, uh, team.
moby
(emphases mine)
Given what I said a few weeks ago, I resonate with this quite a bit. The quantum perspective radically changed how we perceive the world; our structures have not yet dealt with that fact - even though quantum’s been around for nearly 100 years. Instead, we’ve told Jesus Christ that he cannot deal with this world, that he’s all about the next. We make going to heaven, i.e., getting the h*ll out of here, the end goal of faith, rather than “love God with your whole being and love your neighbor as you love yourself.”
But Jesus, (as argued by Willard and others) was perfectly content with living in the smallest of quantum probabilities, and somehow knew how to access them - so that water could be walked upon, sight could be restored, the lame could be made to walk, and death could bring new life. Oh, yes, and locked doors could be passed through.
With Newton, these are abberations; with quantum, these are distinct possibilities, however improbable. Nevertheless, we don’t expect these things to occur. We don’t believe that they will happen, nor, to one extent or another, do we really want them to. They’ll stir things up too much.
Jesus Christ will always incarnate in every culture everywhere - living in it while challenging it to greater fullness. Whatever our scientific realities may be, he will be faithful to that.
The problem is, however, that the QM equations are every bit as deterministic as the Newtonian equations are. The difference is what is determined. If you specify a wave function at t=0, and then ask what it is at t=”some time later”, then QM gives you an unequivocal, predetermined, answer. QM is really arguing that it’s not things like position and momentum and mass that is fundamental, it is rather the wave function, and those other things are just macroscopic manifestations of it.
I agree with the problem of modern Christianity being much like the Newtonian view of the universe, but that’s a philosophical/theological point that can be made without reference to physics. And it should, because at its most fundamental level ALL physics is deterministic in exactly the same way that Newton’s laws were. This includes relativity and QM. If you read Stephen Hawking’s A Brief History of Time, he believes that there is no such thing as free will precisely because he believes that the only things worth speaking about are the laws of physics, and they are completely deterministic. There’s no hope for having a world of possibilities from any physical theory, it only comes from the fact that there is a spiritual reality which works alongside and sometimes above those laws.
Sorry about the rant, but I’m tired of physical theories being exploited for philosophical purposes because they supposedly imply those sorts of things about the universe, when in actuality they don’t.
Not only that, but the physicists have a field day with religious people (Christians and otherwise) misapprorpriating their theories.
John -
Thanks for the corrective. As a non-physicist, I haven’t spent enough time dealing with the implications of the new theories to really speak as definitively on them as I try to.
That being said, the popular perception of the world has in fact changed - somehow people with a sense of quantum don’t view the world as deterministically as the newtonians. Don’t ask me why… I’m looking at it more sociologically than scientifically.
Nevertheless, you are correct: quantum does make determinations. I suppose we will eventually find a model that gives quantum some wiggle-room, much like we did for Newton.
I’m worried that I sounded a little–err–harsh (got in some kind of mood for some reason). This of course, is not to say that there are not implications to be drawn from physics, I would just argue there are different ones. I think the most important philosophical implication we learn from physics is that physics by itself is inadequate to explain the entirety of the universe (this is implied for a number of reasons that I won’t put people to sleep by going through
).
You do have a point, of course, sociologically.
Now I’m going to go lay off the caffeine for a while.
[...] t it might help someone who has a question like that other guy did. A little while ago I ranted a little bit when my friend Matt was quoting someone else dr [...]
ABOUT man’s significance, and Quantum Physics:
May I suggest to you that your HUMAN significance is found in the truth that the Word of God states that YOU..were “MADE in the image and likeness of GOD”,(and not “monkey spawn”) and were given DOMINION in the earth to act as little lords over the earth realm in the manifestation of the KINGDOM of God in the earth. May I suggest to you my friend….that your SIGNIFICANCE is in the fact that MAN was God’s CROWNING creation. May I also bring to your processes of thought that CREATION..was “created” for MAN, and not…visa versa. God, in Genesis created the earth FIRST and then created and PLACED his man IN it. God..PREpared a place for him. EDEN, is defined as the GARDEN of His Presence, and this is where God originally “SET” His man before the fall of man where Adam and Eve eat of the forbidden fruit..etc. Jesus came to restore man back to GOD through His blood sacrifice and man’s acceptance of Him and it.
AS FOR the quantum physics end,…ALL that says is that GOD can be HEARD through His handiwork of CREATION.
“The HEAVENS declare the Glory of God; and the firmaments (the great expanse of the sky) Shows and proclaims His handiwork..!..!! Day after day pours forth Speech,..and night after night shows forth knowledge. There IS no speech nor spoken word from the Stars; their voice is NOT heard. Yet..their voice (IN EVIDENCE) goes OUT through ALL….the earth, their sayings….to the end of the world….! Of the heavens has God made a TENT for the sun.” (Psa. 19:1-5).
DNA..is said to be “the LANGUAGE of God”. LANGUAGE is “spoken”, it can be HEARD..(the PERCEPTION of sound), deciphered, broken down, translated…and READ. Quauntum physics states that ALL things have…SOUND, or vibriation. MAN himself is but “an ECHO” of God where God SAID (sound) “LET US (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) create MAN in OUR image and after OUR likeness”..etc. (Gen. 1:26) MAN..and ALL that God MADE are but REverberations of an ORIGINAL SOUND! “And God said,’Light BE, and light WAS’ ” from Gen. 1…is but the SOUND God made..turning back and fulfilling it’s command. SOUND. Quantum physics is but another venue to SEE God in and through CREATION. You…, your significance is not FOUNDED in “nature” or “creation”. It is FOUNDED in God. I hope that this adds something of WORTH to your blog. It’s been fun!
YOU..an an “ECHO” of God…saying “_____your name___” BE!
closing NOW.
We must remember that science simply illuminates God’s craftsmanship. God is the Master Architect. We must follow Christ where ever he leads us. Right now he is leading us through quantum physics. Jesus Christ had complete dominion over this earthly exsistence. His example was for our benefit. In other words, miracles can happen through you too. Hopefully organized Christianity will not persecute the present day Galileos. For creations that are only engaging 10% of their brain power and DNA potential, we are awfully arrogant. Somehow there is a connection between the double slit experiment results and the story of Adam and Eve. God is speaking to our limited evolving system and we need to believe him even if we don’t understand him. Scripture tells us that He is just too glorious for our present day knowledge. Personally, I am excited and in awe of what quantum physics is revealing about the mind of God. Deeper depths, higher heights, from glory to glory. I say, Let’s go!